Kathryn: I’m so excited to have Andréa Jones on the show today. Welcome Andréa.
Andréa: Oh, thank you so much for having me. I’m really excited and looking forward to our conversation today.
Kathryn: Me too. I’ve been looking forward to it for a while. Andréa’s another friend that I met at Pod Fest. Y’all are sick of hearing me say that, but that was the one last big thing I was able to attend before COVID so it holds a warm place in my heart, especially right now. So I’m happy to reconnect with you again today. And I know a little bit about you, but for those of in my audience who don’t know you, will you fill us in a little bit?
Andréa: Yeah, for sure. So I’m a social media strategist, and I work with business owners, passion led entrepreneurs, helping them get the attention they deserve through social media marketing.
So I do that in a number of ways, but mostly through my done for you services. So. For a lot of my clients, I’m actually posting for them. I’m managing their communities, growing their communities, but then I also teach and coach other business owners and social media managers as well to do it for themselves and their clients, through the savvy social school and my podcast, the savvy social podcast.
So I’m really committed to kind of making it simple and easy and fun and there’s so many, like competing advices out there, competing pieces of advice. So I try to help people really figure out what works for them.
Kathryn: Yes. So. What led you up to this? Like, what did you do before this? How did you get into this?
Andréa: So I actually worked at a spa in Atlanta. I’m from Atlanta, Georgia. And I actually was promoted fairly quickly, was in management, worked that for a few years, but being the youngest person on the team, I was put in the social media marketing role. This was between let’s say 2008 and 2013. So that’s when, you know, Facebook was just getting started.
Instagram was just being created as a thing. And so a lot of what I was doing was figuring it out for these larger companies at the same time I was making my own YouTube videos. So I was fairly introverted, but I loved kind of creating content and blogging and making YouTube videos and all of that good stuff.
So I was making YouTube videos and I met my husband on YouTube.
Kathryn: No way. I’m going to have to hear about that.
Andréa: Yeah. I mean, we met kind of like, we’re doing this podcast conversation here. It was the same thing, but just on YouTube. And we just kept talking after that. But because of that, it was kind of a bit of a catalyst for starting my business because I decided to leave Atlanta and come to Canada.
We lived in Toronto at the time and because of that, that’s when I started the business. So it really had never crossed my mind until, I basically wanted to upset my whole life and move to a totally different country. But yeah, that’s kind of like how I got into what I’m doing today. And I actually happen to like social media as an introverted person.
I find I have the ability to cultivate conversations and relationships a bit on my own time and at my own pace. And so that’s why I really liked social media and why I still like it today.
Kathryn: Okay. Well, I’m excited to dive in to several things that you just shared with us, but first of all, really, how did you meet your husband on YouTube?
Andréa: Yes. You know what? It started off as I saw his video and I commented on it and I was like, I like your green eyes totally flirting. And he said, they’re actually blue. That was like our first conversation.
Kathryn: What was his video about? So he was doing these like. Comedy like rant videos. And at the time I actually went to a YouTube conference, called VidCon, out in LA.
Andréa: And one of the pieces of advice was collaborate with other YouTubers who have the same number of subscribers as you. So I had collaborated with probably like I don’t know, a dozen other people around that time. Like I was really trying to build my channel. And he just happened to be one of those people and I thought he was kind of cute and I liked his Canadian accent and here we are.
Kathryn: Well, that is so funny. I absolutely love that. So, you know, this podcast is all about thriving imperfectly letting go of perfection, just taking action. Throughout that whole journey of working at a spa, then totally starting your own thing and social media, marrying and moving to a different country…
what sort of issues did you face? Limiting beliefs, battles with perfection. Did anything like that come up for you along the way?
Andréa: Yeah. Actually, when I first started the business, it wasn’t even a business in my head. I was just thinking, I’m going to see how I can make some money online because I was not a Canadian resident yet.
So I technically couldn’t work in Canada. And so I wanted a way to do that. So to me in my head, it wasn’t a business and it really wasn’t until like three or four years in that I was like, Oh, this is a business. For the longest time, I was still thinking, I’m just making some money online to, you know, contribute to the family.
Right. And so that belief stuck with me for a long time and it actually stopped me from treating it like a business. So even little things like. You know, paying for a tool like a online, I don’t know, productivity tool. I would never pay for it. Cause I would go in my head, I’ll just do it and you know, do it the long way or like use a Google spreadsheet or a Google doc and set up something better.
And that actually cost me time and time is money. And it wasn’t until, you know, now looking back, I can I recognize that, but at the time I was so into the idea of that I was just going to try to make this into something that would just be some revenue for the family.
I also think when I first started, I didn’t recognize the skill set that I had and being strategic on social media because I enjoyed it. I thought, well, everybody, anybody can do this. Yeah.
Kathryn: There’s some limiting beliefs. Really. How about a little bit of imposter syndrome? Like, why are people gonna want to learn this for me? Like, I’m not really an expert.
Right. I just know. A little bit about how to do this. And then that limiting belief kind of limited you in thinking this is not a real business. I can’t invest more money in myself to move this forward is what it sounds like.
Andréa: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And it’s one of those things too, that if you, if something comes easy to you, if it feels natural to you and it feels good to do it, then you’re good at it.
And I think that sometimes we think being good at something, you know, you have to have a degree or you have to have gotten to school for it, or you have to have, you know, formally studied it, but some of it is intuition. And I was totally discounting that.
Kathryn: And, also the thought of, if I can do it, everybody can do it.
Right. That thought comes up. At least it comes up for me. If I can do this so easily. Well then that means it’s easy and everybody can do it. No, what it means is it’s something that I’m good at. So, so yeah. So tell me what it is. Well, we were talking earlier and I really should start taping the second that I start talking to a guest, because I always learn things in that part that I wish that everyone knew when we were talking about fear.
Right. And a tattoo that you have, tell everybody about that.
Andréa: Yes. So grow going up, my dad used to call me fearless. He would say Andréa’s so fearless. Out of all of my siblings, I was always the first to like jump in the pool or to try something new because I was a naturally curious child and I still am today.
But that fearlessness, to me, isn’t the lack of fear. It’s doing something despite the fear, because you know what’s on the other side of it. We just want to find out what’s on the other side of it. So I have a tattoo. My dad called me fearless, so I got my mom to actually write it in her handwriting.
And yes, I got it on me to remind me of that, that fact that, it’s not that we’re not. Like everyone’s afraid, everyone’s scared of something, but it’s. I’d rather figure out what’s on the other side of that than sit here, wondering during and being afraid.
And so that’s, you know, we talk about like moving to another country with my husband, starting a business, all those things are like really scary life changing things.
But I find that because I can look back on it and I put myself in those fear positions often to me, I’d rather go through it and figure out what’s on the other side rather than being paralyzed by the fear.
Kathryn: Oh, I absolutely love that. And is there any better feeling in the world than getting to that other side of fear?
Like without the fear, the satisfaction isn’t as rich and rewarding to me, right. I love that because that’s what I talk about with my clients all the time. And they eight different ways, eight different domains of your life. The way to be satisfied in your life is to acknowledge the anxiety and fear that comes up when you think about things that are important to you, and then you take those things that are important and you put it right in front of your face so that you can see that and be driven toward that with your action, rather than letting the fear stop you. So totally in line with that. I love it. Tell me what you do for your clients with social media.
Because I mean, well actually let me start with this. A lot of people, I’m a little bit older than you, or a lot older than you. I’m 51. And a lot of people my age, I think struggle with social media and what it can mean for their business. What are they missing out on? If they are not marketing through social media?
Andréa: Absolutely. Yeah. And I think that that social media can appear like something it isn’t at first. So it’s not like a television ad or radio ad or a billboard ad. In fact, it’s oftentimes not really like advertising at all. It’s more like relationship building. It’s if you think of social media like a community in a small town, you’re supporting your community by going to shop locally.
You’re supporting the people in it by, you know, showing up to community events and getting to know the people around you so that they can come to your shop as well and support you in return. And so social media is more of a give and take in that way. It’s more of a relationship building avenue for a lot of businesses, especially personality-driven businesses where you’re selling yourself, essentially. Like if you’re a service-based business or a coach or something like a podcaster, people want to get to know you and like you and trust you.
And so social media offers you the platform to be able to do that. And to be able to connect with people in a way that’s never been done before on this scale in history ever. So I think it’s a very magical thing, but for a lot of, business owners, creatives, coaches out there, it can feel very overwhelming because there’s a lot of options.
Kathryn: Yes. So how do you decide. Like there are so many different platforms. Right. And I think, I know personally I get bogged down and feeling like I need to be doing something on every platform and I just can’t. How do you help your clients through that? What do you do there?
Andréa: I like to use an analogy for that feeling of like, I want to do all of the things, but it feels overwhelming.
So I like to relate this to CrossFitters because when I look at people who do CrossFit, they’ve got like muscles on muscles in my head. I go, that looks exhausting. I admire them, but that’s not the life for me kind of thing. So I think times when we’re comparing ourself as a business, we’re like comparing ourselves to CrossFitters.
Right? So you want to make sure that you’re actually being realistic. If you are doing your social media plan, you want to be realistic about where you’re going with it. If you’re not trying to be like the superstars of the internet marketing world, what does that look like for a normal person? Like your regular business owner?
And so typically we’re just using one platform and I encourage you to start with the one that you’re already using. Most of us already have one where we kind of check in regularly. If you don’t have one, take a look at what’s popular here and now, so we’re recording this in July of 2020. Instagram and Instagram stories. If a new business came to me today, I would suggest that’s a place to start because it’s fairly easy to grow. It’s fairly easy to use and connect with people. But start where you are now. And start small. Start spending an hour or two of your work week, just focus on social media.
And then this is like, if we’re talking about the CrossFit to regular person, this is like five to 10 pound weights, right. You’re just getting used to the idea or you’re using the platform. And you want to focus on two different things you want to focus on actually talking about what you do on social media, whether that be posting an image, sharing a video, writing some text, and then you also want to focus on connecting with people.
So there’s the two sides of it. So dedicate an hour or two of your week to doing that. And I guarantee you’ll see results over time.
Kathryn: Okay, great. So. Are people my age and older on Instagram right now? Or are they still all on Facebook?
Andréa: They are absolutely on Instagram. I think it’s such a powerful platform for connecting.
I think the challenge with Facebook, outside of Facebook groups, just Facebook itself, the challenge is finding new people to connect with. Whereas with Instagram, it’s almost built into the culture of the platform that you’re going to find new people to connect with. And so that’s the important second piece of the strategy.
Now, Facebook groups is a great place to do that. So depending on your business, like I recently actually joined, a paid program that had that has a Facebook group, and it’s been a fantastic way to meet new people. So if you can find Facebook groups that have your people in them, I think you can, absolutely use that as a tool to grow your network. And your goal here is to get people who’ve never heard of you before to just know that you exist. That’s the first step it’s like, they don’t even know that you have an offer out there. They don’t even know what you do. So how can we take that one step into their world to let them know that you’re there.
Kathryn: What’s the best way to do that?
Andréa: Well, you know, it’s kind of a little bit like dating where, you know, if you decided that you’re going to go on the hunt and find your person, you’d probably try a few different things, right? You probably sign up for an app. Maybe you’d let your friends know they could recommend someone to you, or maybe even you just since you made that decision, if you’re in a coffee shop, maybe you’ll have a longer conversation with someone than you would otherwise.
Right. So I think when you are on social media, it’s kind of taking that approach. You can’t really approach it as if “is this the one?” like for every single person that you meet, you have to be a little bit more open minded and say, I’m just going to try to meet people and know that my intention is to grow my audience, but I’m not going to jump in there with like, Hey, I’m looking to marry someone.
Would you like to marry me? You know? So when we’re talking about our business, most often in something casual, like, Hey, what do you do? Or have you ever had this challenge or just, you know, simply starting a conversation with the other person.
Kathryn: Okay. Perfect. So what do you normally help your clients do? What is the number one thing that your clients come to you and say, I need help with this. And then how do you go about helping them? Do you have a process?
Andréa: Yeah. So lately I’ve been talking a lot about to my introverts out there about the connection piece, because, you know, in theory it sounds great.
It’s like, oh, I get it. I understand how it works. But in practice, sometimes we do get paralyzed by that fear that comes up again. So there are a few things that I suggest to those people who are feeling like, man, this feels like I’m putting myself out there too much, or what will people say? So the first thing is to find an area of connection.
Find an area of connection. So typically for me, this means, you know, if I’m on Instagram, for instance, and I’m looking for people to connect with, I’m probably gonna look for people. Maybe they’re in Atlanta, I’m from Atlanta. I can at least start a conversation about that. Maybe they’re in the town I live in now near Niagara falls.
So maybe I can start a conversation about that. You know, maybe they’re also in social media, I can start a conversation about that. So it’s finding a reason to connect with them. And then the second kind of, step to that is complimenting them. So we all like compliments, right? And if you think about the dating analogy, sometimes when you’re just starting a conversation with someone, it may be like, Hey, I like your shoes or I like your shirt.
Like some, you never know. Sometimes it’s the smallest things like that. So a great way to do this is actually with Instagram stories specifically, because there are a lot of people creating Instagram stories and they’re actually raising their hand saying I’d love to have a conversation about this topic.
If they’re creating Instagram stories that are publicly available, they’re basically asking for a conversation. And so as an introverted person, it doesn’t feel like you’re inviting yourself unannounced there. They’re kind of extending the invitation first. So if you find an area of connection and you lead with a compliment, that can be a really great strategy to start building up new connections and new opportunities, because you never know where the conversation may take you.
Kathryn: Yeah. I absolutely love Instagram. Like I was able to meet, The Middle Aged Goddess on Instagram and have her on the podcast all the way from Australia. And so I do love how you can find others on Instagram and make these connections. It’s really fun. I can’t say that I’m very good at it yet, but I do enjoy it and I’m going to keep pursuing those conversations on Instagram because I’m loving the people that I’m meeting.
Andréa: Yeah. And I think, like you said, it’s not about the perfect piece. Cause you talk about that a lot on this podcast. It’s not about doing it flawlessly. In fact, for awhile, I was leaving voice messages for folks because I really enjoyed the personality of it. And sometimes I can push past the fear a little bit with talking versus typing.
There have been several times where I went, let like words escape me, you know what I mean? But I think everybody has those moments and it adds a little bit of humanity to the, to the connection process.
Kathryn: Yes, the need for perfection that I tell people all the time, I’m a recovering perfectionist and it’s something that I have to battle a lot.
And for me, with the Instagram stories or creating videos, it’s always like, do I need to go get, like, fix my hair? Do I need to go make sure that my makeup is on as well as I can put it on? It’s sort of a battle for how I need to look in the video. I battled that piece of it all the time versus focusing on what the video is about.
Does that, does that make sense? Does that ever get in the way for your other clients?
Andréa: Yeah, absolutely. And in fact, I created a whole class for my clients on how to use Instagram stories without being on video, because a lot of us go through that.
And while I do encourage you to examine that feeling, to push past it, there are alternatives to using that tool as a connection piece. And the easiest way is if you’re looking at Instagram stories, like open up Instagram stories, it’s gonna like either show your face at an awkward angle or you’re gonna be looking at nothing. And so right next to that at the bottom says, create. So you’re going to swipe, I believe, to the left and you’re going to be in the create section of Instagram stories and it’s just a blank screen with a solid color.
So instead of coming on video to share your story, to talk about your process, try typing it in the create section of the story and think about it almost like yeah. Think about it almost like a slideshow. So you know how, when you’re building slides and like PowerPoint or whatever, you have the little bullet points that builds on top of each other.
So when you’re creating your stories, think about how you can build on top of it. So. Have a part, one, a part two, part three, and typically three to five parts is a great kind of story flow. And so that’s a great way to still use stories. You don’t have to turn on the camera. You can still connect and then have fun with it.
There’s a lot of like polls and questions and ways to like really connect with people in stories. And so typically that’s a really great place to start. And then that way, you know, if it’s a no-makeup day, you know, you don’t have to, you don’t have to pressure yourself.
Kathryn: Yes. I mean, I find myself trying to plan my stories around the days when I’ve actually like washed my hair and gotten ready and sometimes that’s just too much, like it takes too long and then I can’t get everything else done.
So I knew I would learn a lot from you today. And that is one particular point that I’m definitely going to pursue in my own Instagram stories. So I appreciate that. So how exactly do you get, especially your introvert clients to start a direct messaging strategy? What does that look like?
Andréa: Yeah. So the easiest place to start is with the stories. And if, even if you’re struggling to respond with something to say, like I mentioned earlier, have a connection point or have a compliment, even if that’s a sticking point to you as soon as you click on an Instagram story and at the bottom, typically it says, send a message.
When you tap on that Instagram stories will actually recommend emojis for you. Some of them is like, it’s like a heart or like a flame for like fire or like a shocked face. Right? So start by just committing to doing three or four of those a day. You don’t have to type anything, but see how you can respond with an emotion via emoji to someone’s story.
And that sometimes is all it takes to spark a conversation. Okay. And also keep in mind that with the stories, people are putting themselves out there, they’re reaching a hand out to you into the conversation, instead of you having to initiate the conversation, which where a lot of us get a little bit stuck.
I know I do. So think about it as people are putting themselves out there, they’re looking for you. All you have to do is respond and they’ll know that you’re there.
Kathryn: Oh, I love that, especially because I don’t know don’t quote me, but I think it was Maya Angelou, who’s one of my favorites said, you know, you may forget what someone says, but you will never forget how they made you feel.
So I love that. And you’re using the emoji or using the emotion instead of words to spark that connection. And you’re letting that other person know, this is how your post made me feel. So, I mean, that could be such a strong way to begin a new connection. Yeah, absolutely. I’ve loved that. Do you find at all that in helping your introverts with their social media, that it helps them in their other connections in life? It helps them bring out parts of themselves connecting in person as well?
Andréa: Yes, absolutely. And even building their business as well. So, you know, we’re in the middle of a pandemic for instance. So my introverts are actually being the ones, teaching their friends how to use zoom, you know, hosting the virtual get together.
But then also showing up for their people as a leader. So one of the things we recently talked about in my community was that with the pandemic and everything that’s going on in the world, it’s just kind of, life’s flipped upside down. People are looking to you as a business owner, as a leader.
And even if you don’t see yourself as a leader, you are holding space for someone. Someone’s looking up to you. So this is your opportunity to show up for them. In the very beginning of this, a lot of my introverts were facilitating conversations as a leader. So you don’t have to come up with all the ideas, right?
You don’t have to say, this is what we’re going to do. Step one, two, three, four. Leadership can look like: hey, I want to create a solution to this. I’m going to set this space up and help us together, come up with a solution. And so for a lot of introverts, that feels a lot better. It feels more natural and organic.
It doesn’t feel like you have to be this powerhouse of a person controlling the conversation, but you’re still in that leader position.
Kathryn: Yeah. So, what I’m hearing you say is you don’t always have to contribute with them is amazing content and these words of wisdom, your contribution can be getting everyone else together to see what comes out of it and the collaboration and the sharing and the ideas that can come out of that can be beautiful and amazing.
Andréa: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And I think for some introverts, or even extroverts who feel like tired or exhausted, it can almost feel like a bit of a weight lifted off the shoulders because it’s not on you to come up with the plan or make a decision. All you have to do is make the space for that to happen.
Kathryn: Yeah, that’s awesome. I love that. So if one of our listeners wants to find out more about you or to work with you, where should they go look?
Andréa: Yeah. So if you want to learn more about my approach to social media, I do have a free course. You can find it by going to onlinedrea.com/free that’s onlinedrea.com/free and it walks you through some of the things we talked about, like how to build connections, but also some of the things we haven’t touched on in this episode, which is, you know, building a content plan and things like that. So definitely start there and it’s a kind of a sample of my coaching program.
If you want to work with me one on one, you can check that out on my website at onlinedrea or anywhere on online, like I said, I’m loving Instagram stories right now. So it’s @onlinedrea on Instagram.
Kathryn: That is awesome. And I will include that free course in our show notes, for sure. So that everybody can just click on that link and go right to you.
But I suggest that y’all follow Andréa on Instagram or at least go look at her website because I’ve been, we’re doing this via Zoom and I can look at her as we are talking and I’m absolutely mesmerized y’all. She’s so beautiful. And her mouth is perfect. So you’ve got like her teeth. I’m just like what?
So you’re going to have to at least go somewhere where you can see her outside of this podcast because she is just so beautiful. So go check her out.
Andréa: Funny thing is I wore braces for five years. So from eighth grade to until I was a senior in high school, so bad. And this was like, they’ve gotten a lot better with braces.
Now, these days back then you had to wear braces for so long. So, yeah, the teeth, it was a long process.
Kathryn: Well, I’m telling you it may have been miserable for you for that long, but it’s worth it because like, it’s hard for me to look away. Like, they’re just, they’re so pretty. I guess I just have a funny thing about teeth, but they’re so pretty.
So y’all make sure you go follow Andréa on Instagram and check out her website. Well, you know, there are so many more questions I could ask you and I could go on all day, but to wrap things up, I asked the same question of my guests every week. And that is what is one imperfect action you would suggest our listeners take today that will bring them closer to their best lives.
Andréa: Yeah. So one thing that’s really worked for me lately is mindful space. I hesitated because I call it meditation for myself. Some people don’t necessarily need to have that term on it, but I think this is so important with the digital world that we live in too where we have lots of notifications and everything’s online and we’re constantly looking at something and going, going, going so.
It’s not, it doesn’t have to be perfect. I do this for about one to five minutes a day, some days I completely miss it. When I moved recently, I missed like two weeks. That’s fine. It doesn’t have to be perfect, but give yourself empty space to let your brain just be, leave it alone for a second. Don’t fill it with things.
And I think that powerful way to improve your life. Again, doesn’t have to be perfect. I use an app. I use the Headspace app. I find it to be very helpful for me. It could be what it can look like, whatever you want us to look like. But I think especially with the digital world, we need to just let our brains just be for a minute, at least.
And I think that’s a, you know, it’s a very powerful strategies, really helped me reduce my anxiety and things like that.
Kathryn: Well, I absolutely love that suggestion and could not agree more. It is always when I finally pull back from work, pull back from everything and it might be when I’m in the shower, it might be when I’m just sitting outside, but it is the minute that I shut my brain completely down and quit the worry. Quit the planning. That the best ideas show up. And so I completely concur. So y’all today, make sure that in your busy, busy life that you take a moment or two, one to five minutes to just step back from everything. And be in quiet, be in silence and just see what happens and give yourself that opportunity.
I think that you’ll be really happy that you did. And so, until we meet here next week, go out and take imperfect action toward the life that you want. And thank you so much, Andréa for being with us today.
Andréa: Thank you so much for having me. This was fantastic.
Kathryn: Oh, thank you again.